#it doesnt have to be romantic love!!!
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Anatomy of a hug 🫶
Bonus without ribs/heart under cut
I did a hell of a lot more shading than I usually do for this one but it's my boys so idc
#dead boy detective fanart#dead boy detective agency#dead boy detectives#dead boy detective netflix#dbda#dbda art#my art#digital art#art#meadowsart#edwin payne#edwin dead boy detectives#edwin paine#charles rowland#charles dead boy detectives#sighs. sorry this isnt jrwi again#i just love these losers so much#btw 😇 if youre a jrwi fan seeing this you should totally watch dead boy detectives#i cant give you any reasons you just have to trust me#payneland#paineland#<- look it doesnt HAVE to be read romantically but i definitely drew it romantically#is it so bad i want them to kiss
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ok guys. i have to be so real with you. luke saying annabeth is like a little sister to him was not just added for the tv show he says that in the book ("she would never... i mean, she's like a little sister to me" (page 223))
#personally i have never understood why people think that the scene in last olympian is luke saying he loves annabeth romantically#'did you love me' can mean so many things and also luke saying annabeths his lil sister doesnt necessarily mean annabeth doesnt have a crush#its extremely common for little kids to crush on people older than them#like i wouldnt be surprised if they drop that plotline but to me its always been deeper than 'annabeth has a crush on luke'#am i being a lil pedantic and petty. perhaps#percy jackson#mine#pjo tv#pjo#luke castellan#annabeth chase
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zoro who is so caught off guard by sanji’s kinder actions towards him is one of my favorite tropes. sanji crafting him specialized post workout snacks personally adjusted for him but still down to fight and call him names. he’s still the biggest asshole zoro has ever had the displeasure of knowing, and he’s horribly considerate. he’s a little confused but doesn’t reject any of sanji’s specialized treats. it’s not like sanji is fawning and doting over him like he does nami, so zoro feels like he can cross off sanji actually liking him from his list of reasons as to why sanji is acting like this. but it’s still fucking strange..
meanwhile sanji is in his kitchen wondering how zoro hasn’t taken a damn hint yet
#i always thought sanji was really weird about showing affection to anybody who isnt nami or robin#bcz with them its just second nature like he likes them so much its so easy to shower them in love#meanwhile you have ZORO who is like#‘is that asshole trying to kill me?’#zoro who thinks its similar to when you get a dog excited to get into the car only for them to go to the vet#thinks sanji is ‘buttering him up’ for his own sick desire#sanji whose sick desire is literally just to make snacks for his crewmate as a display of care#doesnt even have to be romantic just wants to show a bit of appreciation#still tagging as zosan because. luv my babas#zoro: wtf is your problem#sanji who just made him lunch: MY problem??#zosan#one piece#txt#roronoa zoro#headcanon#sanji#vinsmoke sanji#zoro#prompt
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Gay horse man looks like a princess
Gay horse man learns to respect trans butch lesbians and various other people who won't date him
#zephyr breeze#zephyr breeze redesign#rainbow dash#rainbow dash and zephyr breeze#mlp fanart#mlp redesign#skyscraper gods#shire draws mlp#listen he was clearly gay#shire draws#but kept hitting on rainbow dash and insisting she was in love with him#so therefore there must be some mistake#He seems the self absorbed type to decide he knows exactly who everyone is on sight if it suits his vanity#I dont see him as intentionally doing it to be phobbic#it just doesnt occur to him that people might be different from his headcanons#When it finally does get through his head he will respect it while pining about what could have been#he will never fully apologize but he will stop hitting on her at least#also rainbow likes men fine just not romantically#all of these headcanons are new as of this post and are just true because its funny
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Vanha Kauppahalli date: en full, a 2 minute 50 second masterpiece...
Primetime Panthers | 11.6.24 (x)
#aleksander barkov#matthew tkachuk#florida panthers#2425#the global series is a gift#“alright talk to me what do we got?” with the camera following behind them makes it seems like theyre spies doing reconnaissance#the start to a thriller where they got sent to finland stake out for intelligence#maffhew not even waiting for sasha to answer before hes asks about chocolate#“the purple one you always bring” maffhew has been charmed by sashas leaving choco in stalls as gifts when he comes back from finland huh#you can tell he says that with depravity of a man who finally realises he doesnt need to rely on his supplier he can get it himself now#“uh oh [laughs] okay... what is this?” maffhew was not prepared for all the food to already be ready for him he just hopped off a plane and#expected to have to wait more and did not and absolutely does not trust the situation in the same way you get romantic candlelit-dinnered#and youre like alright whats all this then whats your angle what are you doing#“this is salmon and rye bread ��” “(with the eagerness to prove hes smart and engaged) so is that 👉” “(charmed) and so is that 🫱”#“ill try your favourite first” GURL RELAX OKAY SETTLE DOWN YOURE IN A NEW COUNTRY JUST CHILL MAN#“salmon and rye bread—thats the famous one 🤓” [sasha nodding along because he has to reassure maffhew but also hes in the middle of eating]#maffhew choosing the most inopportune time and you can TELL sasha is like [swallows quickly] because he wants to answer but also BIG BITE#“herring” “herrin' 🤠?” “eating all this her-RING” no notes#“is this just another salmon on rye bread” he says with hope because he likes salmon but also disappointment (he wants to try more foods)#“different salmon? smoked?” the amount of questions hes askijg because hes so terribly engaged he wants to know and sashas like [shrug]#he has to get an A+ in experiencing finland which is normal to want and possible to achieve#“i still love your country though” and sasha explodes into the mirthful grin ive seen in my life like he just won the damn jackpot#he speaks at 100 mph like please take a deep breath sweetheart youre excitement is papable but PLEASE#THE WAY HE GETS SO UNSURE WHEN HE MENTIONS BARKY HATES THAT FOOD WHEN HE LIKED IT SO MUCH#MAFFHEW YOU CAN GET A PASSING GRADE IN EXPERIENCING FINLAND IF YOU STICK TO YOUR GUNS I PROMISE#SASHA HELP A GUY OUT HERE MAN THROW HIM A BONE#SASHA ONLY LAUGHS AS MAFFHEW THROWS HIMSELF INTO A TIZZY OVER THIS YOU ARE SOOOOOO#the chuckle when sasha mentions he had runebergin torttu in school... id like to know what was funny there#we call out sasha for being too lovesick and laughing at all of maffhews “jokes” BUT HES JUST AS BAD???#“what the hell do i do with this thing?” MAFFHEW HAVE YOU NEVER SEEN MERENGUE IN YOUR LIFE???
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Angel Dust Turns Human - Pg1
I need to mention how insane it is that Angel Dust is like, around 8ft tall. I'm not good at drawing tall people, so his human form made him shorter since, if he was alive, he'd be at least around 6ft; that's as tall as he's gonna get!
Anyways, I like Angel Dust centered media bc he's my fav🫶👨❤️💋👨 It upset me, when I finally watched the damn show, how little screen time he had (no, those 2 episodes were not enough for me). Personally, I don't think his character was that explored, so I'm just stretching him out a bit in this - even if it goes against Canon, sorry☹️
In fact, this whole comic goes against Canon😔. Since the whole point is Parental Alastor & Angel as a son figure. I don't see enough of that (obviously since it doesn't fit much but idc) so I made my own.
It's also possessive Alastor, since I really love 'yandere' parental/platonical relationships, there's not much media with that trope💔
NO ROMANCE! This whole thing is found family🙏
#hazbin hotel#angel dust#alastor#charlie morningstar#human au#? i guess#parental figures#comic art#fanart#yandere parent#possesive love#/platonic#no romantic relationships#no romance#sorry guys I just dont ship Angel dust w anyone :(#not that he CANT be in a relationship. I just dont see him in one - or the one I picture in my head#it makes me sad that he doesnt rlly have anyone to confide in - excluding any potential romantic partners#I dont count charlie since their relationship is rarely ever shown; I dont rlly see the two being close - no matter how hard they tried#alastor being a parental figure is mainly because of his 'creepy/scary' aspect - I like parents who are intimidating. even to their kids#husk couldve also been a father figure here but I just dont see it sorry - hes too much of a drunk so..#hes better off as a pal#hazbin art#hazbin lucifer
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BOO!!! domestic fluff ahasbands be upon yee!!
#trafficshipping#mumbo jumbo#inthelittlewood#martyn itlw#ahasbands#sunsfin#martyn acting like he doesnt also have a husband smh#redwood#you are free to interpret this as romantic or platonic btw#love them either way#last life
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We always talk about Mike and his feelings, but what about Eleven’s? Does El really love Mike? Yes, that’s FOR SURE! Romantically? I doubt it.
In s1, right before Mike kisses her, she literally asked him if she would be HIS SISTER. If Mike would’ve said yes, everything would’ve been different cause guess what: Eleven didn’t want a boyfriend, she wanted a friend/family. She probably didn’t even know what a “boyfriend” was apart from what she had seen in the movies.
From that moment, she follows Mike’s steps bc that’s what Mike had decided: she was his girlfriend, they must kiss all day cause that’s what couples do in the movies……. how romantic is that… They didn’t read comics, watch movies, bake something or paint, we haven’t seen any real heart-to-heart moment or a real conversation like we have seen with Lumax or Jancy.
So where is the chemistry? Easy: it doesn’t exist.
Mike saved her, gave her food and a home, friends and love… that’s all she wanted because she had just scaped from a LAB. She barely even know how to speak in s1 & 2, in s3 she still didn’t know how it felt really liking something, she doesn’t even know who she is as an individual human being.
She’s been quite “obsessed” with Mike over the years and that’s been mistaken by “romantic LOVE”.
And it also pisses me off how people see a boy and a girl be friends and automatically they must be together forever and marry and have kids…. Like bffr.
If they would’ve stayed like brother and sister their dynamic would’ve worked so much better. Romantically, they’re BONES.
Also, here’s a parallel between Mike and El and Hopper (her dad) and El… even her hug with Will had more emotion
#i said what i said and i would say that AGAIN#mike saved her and so did hopper#it doesnt have to be ROMANTIC#platonic mileven u will forever be loved#byler#stranger things#mike wheeler#eleven hopper#hopper#st5#byler endgame
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Something I wonder about Simon and Betty's relationship is how long they were together before the whole crown ordeal. But they were engaged, you say. My aunt (in)famously met my uncle and had a ring on her finger in 8 weeks. We've seen that both Betty and Simon were both weird outcasts, crazy determined and a pinch insane. I would not be surprised if they decided they'd met their one true love and got engaged super quick.
My point being, Betty's shifting to revolve around Simon and Simon's rose colored glasses of their relationship feels very much like New Love. They're people who love each other and love being a couple but still haven't quite figured out how to coexist together, as two people in a partnership. I feel like if they'd known each other longer, lived together longer, some of the issues we're seeing would have probably self resolved.
I don't think their relationship is toxic nor is it totally perfect. It's two lonely, most likely neurodivergent people in a relatively early relationship still figuring out how it works. Everything that happened afterwards: the crown, the seperation, the time travel, the magic/madness/sadness just exemplified issues they had both as individuals and as a couple.
#fionna and cake#fionna and cake spoilers#simon petrikov#betty grof#in the tags its either#'oh they're toxic' or 'owo literal soulmates'#but i think its both more simple and yet more complicated#its struck me from the very start that they were eternally engaged#they never got to be married they're still stuck at this in between milestone#plus the way they act/talk around one another it HAS that new relationship vibe#If i were to guess they were each other's first romantic relationship#they loved so hard but they didnt really understand how it worked (mood)#if tehy'd had time and space like normal people yeah I think they'd have been fine#unfortunately all manner of bs got in the way and they never got to resolve some of these issues#it doesnt make one right over the other it just adds another layer of tragedy to their story#they only had time to get to know each other -to really feel understood- before it was taken away#Artists call betty 'simons wife#but its soooo important to me that they never made it that far#a flower that was plucked before it had a chance to bloom#anyway just my thoughts#petrigrov forever
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Relationship envy except I envy the bond between iconic fictional characters Sherlock Holmes and Dr. Watson
#their relationship is so beautifully made#your honor they're everything to me#it doesnt even matter if you view them platonically or romantically#you cant deny the love they have for each other#the way that watson writes about holmes is just full of love and admiration#even though holmes doesnt express his feelings in the same way#he still loves him more than anything#as seen in 3GAR and DEVI#they both love each other so much#they both strengthen each other you see#they protect each other#they're a team#they each bring something unique to the table#but it doesnt feel like one is inferior to the other#at least not to me#traditional relationships always make me feel like someone is inferior/weaker than the other#holmes is smarter intellectually and he's stronger physically#but watson has the emotional intelligence#they balance each other perfectly#theyre PARTNERS in every sense of the word#and i want a relationship like theirs#i feel like traditional gender roles and stuff limit me from having a real relationship like this#as a girl#im expected to be weaker and softer#i mean even sherlock holmes says women are weaker#for gods sake#i feel like i will never achieve this level of equal partnership with a man#sherlock holmes#john watson#holmes/watson
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one big thing about polyshipping for me is, like. you know how some people will have their eyes opened to homoerotic relationships in media bc they'll realize, "wait, if these people were two different genders, i'd 100% assume they're into each other. i have a double standard that i never noticed"?
there's a polyamorous equivalent in certain media that's basically just. "if you didn't assume this character is monogamous, you would 100% believe they have crushes on & are dating all of their friends." OR, "if this character wasn't dating somebody else already, you would 100% interpret this new friendship of theirs as a crush/budding romance."
usually the creators of the media aren't thinking about polyamory when they make it! usually the creators of the media are thinking "i want this character's friends to be as important to them as their romantic partners, we don't get enough of that in media," which is great and true and also EXACTLY WHY IT WORKS AS A POLY NARRATIVE. people will be like you don't Have to polyship why can't you just let platonic relationships be important ugh 🙄 & i'm like i did my years in the "why can't two men just be friends why does everything have to be gay 🙄" trenches. you're not doing this to me. we're not doing it about polyshipping. we're skipping over that whole discourse cutscene because i am Too Tired For It. don't even start
sometimes characters are so full of love and affection and joy for so many people that i start gnawing off my hands about how polyamory isn't normalized. because i'll watch/read certain media and i'll be like. listen. this is a polycule. i know you don't know this because your creators don't know this and that is totally okay but you are a Wildly polyamorous person who's ambiguously trapped in the 2000s/2010s with Big Monogamy psyops eating your brain. please let me free you. please i can give you Everything .
PLEASE KISS YOUR FRIENDS
#what i'd give for more mainstream toh art of the lavender winter quartet that doesnt pair them off together ignoring the others in favor of#their canon romantic partner. what i'd give for explorations of relationships between close friends that arent just#'we have convos about how much we love our canon romantic partners who arent here 💕'#LIKE IT'S CUTE AND HARMLESS. BUT IT MAKES ME FEEL SO LONELYYY#most days i'm fine with no one in mainstream fandom loving the way i do or feeling the way i do.#then some days i wake up thinking about hunter and luz being each other's Types (TM) and feel like ive eaten drywall#aside from the trc ot6 theres like NO polycule that's more desperately 'YOU GUYS WOULD BE CANONICALLY ALL TOGETHER IN A DIFFERENT TIME#PERIOD' than lavwin. IT TORTURES ME. THEY ARE ALL IN LOVE#anyway. i gotta get some more sleep.#thanks for listening everyone. think about the big monogamy psyops in your life and add people to their relationships. it's hilarious
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thinking of zoro who doesn't buy flowers for sanji on valentines day but he comes back home with crates full of unique ingredients sanji's been hoping to taste for ages.
or zoro who takes mental note of every little thing sanji touches in the market but regretfully doesn't buy, every piece of fruit or expensive grain his fingers graze over, and doesn't care that his debt with nami will drive him into an early grave – because when sanji isn't looking, he buys them for him.
or the zoro who Does buy flowers. but not for sanji. the zoro who bestows a bouquet of lilies, chrysanthemums, and carnations every year into sanji's hands as delicately as he would lay his swords to rest for the night. they're never really arranged in the most aesthetic way. he only finds the flowers and ties them together with twine and the occasional ribbon.
zoro who buys a valentines bouquet for sanji's mother – who has never gotten a single flower from her husband her whole life and not even on the day she died. the zoro who sanji knows sora would adore. he buys the flowers sanji wishes he gave her and he keeps them in a vase in the galley until the petals aren't as vibrant as the day he got them.
#happy valentines day this came about because my mom called me her forever valentine#after my dad passed away i was always very sad that she will never have a special valentine#so every year i buy her flowers so that even if she doesnt have a romantic valentine#she has me#i think zoro would do the same for sora despite never meeting her#because his form of devotion is not just Knowing what sanji loves#but showing respect for the person sanji loves the most#zosan#roronoa zoro#sanji#vinsmoke sora#niki's fics: flowers
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there is something so terrifying about wanting to be held, a years deep ache in my bones, like a child sobbing pleading for someone to notice, to care.
come here darling, I swear I will not bite, come here please, smooth away the cracks in my skin, piece me back together with the gold of your love, like the japanese would repair their pottery.
there is something so vulnerable about wanting to be touched, undoing me with a mere brush of the fingers, peeling back my layers like the skin of an orange, and each golden segment of my soul, is an offering (i love you).
oh, do you think you could hold me? just this once? kiss the backs of my knees when they ache? trace the divots of my spine like exploring a foreign land? memorize the shape of my nose, my jaw, my eyes, turning the terrain of my body into something familiar.
Perhaps it is selfish of me to ask for such a thing, I have always been a rather demanding creature, a dog, scratching at the door, begging to be let in.
I will be gentle I swear, curl up in your chest, your ribcage can be a temple, your heart the god I bow before, praying you might hold me, if only for a little while.
#this can be interpreted as platonic or romantic#it probably sounds more romantic#but i didnt really intend for it to come across any specific way#i am kinda proud of this one tho#considering i wrote it in my notebook in like 20 minutes#and then rewrote it here with only a little editing#it doesnt have much of a flow but i still like it#poetry#poems#physical touch#touch starved#skin hunger#physical affection#physical love#having a normal one tonight boys#shitty poetry hours/pos
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oh Red Son no-
#i like to headcanon that for years after dbk’s imprisonment#red son didn’t do anything but work on his engineering skills#or just wallowed within his home#pif didnt give a rats butt about what he was doing because she was already miserable dealing with other people#so red son didnt go out much to socialise or learn from the world#meaning there was a lot of things he didnt know about life and himself until after his father was freed#red son has never had any experiece with having feelings#romantic or platonic or anything. he only recognises familial love thats pretty much it#not because he doesnt feel them (duh) but because hes had no one to feel that way about#so becoming friends with goldendragon was pretty hard for him. but he still pulled through#but recognising his feelings for mk being more than that? that was the hardest yet (for everybody)#of course mei figured it out first. and eventually mk did too. but even red son had no clue until they both had to intervene#so red son realising he is no longer as straight as he once thought because of mk is a very real possibility LMAO#lmk#lego monkie kid#lmk fanart#mk lmk#lmk qi xiaotian#qi xiaotian#lmk red son#lmk spicynoodles#spicynoodleshipping#monkie kid spicynoodles
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what do you MEAN what's the difference
#Shh no one tell him love is an unstoppable force that comes in many forms and isnt always a romantic marriage kinda thing#He doesnt wanna have to kill ppl he loves for Yakuza reasons but then society collapses and the clan is gone and hes like SHIT#'Now I gotta actually confront things in my life god DAMN IT'#I deep cleaned the bathroom and I'm not leaving the house in this snow so that's my work for the day#Posting time#An art#Fuyuhiko kuzuryu#Hajime hinata#Sonia nevermind#Sdr2#Super danganronpa 2#Danganronpa 2#super danganronpa goodbye despair#Kuzuhina
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Hi, hello, just came here to say that I love your fic "trending in Japan". I was wondering if you had headcanons regarding Kenji or Emi or interpersonal relationships and stuff. Many hugs for you.
hi hello, thank you for the encouragement and hugs! After some thought ive realized I do in fact have some hcs about some of the character dynamics in the movie as well as just kenji himself, cause hes captivated my entire brain:
Kenji & Emi
Emi does not have teeth but she does inexplicably have a teething phase. kenji is forced to hide all his (salvaged) fancy cars in the garage bc the corvette's already been chewed to hell and his heart is gonna give out if he has to watch any more classics get wrecked
he reads her bedtime stories. A lot of aesop's fables, because theyre short and fun and hes trying to raise his monster daughter with good morals. emi goes hogwild for these but its unclear if she actually understands what hes saying; kenji's pretty sure she just likes the silly voices he uses for different characters
they go flying together! they go first thing in the morning before breakfast - it helps kenji shake off the grogginess of sleep and emi gets to stretch her wings. shes not able to go very far for very long initially, but as she grows and gets those cardio gainz she almost gets to be quicker than him. they have races and play air tag :)
while she doesnt have the vocal range to speak english herself, it becomes clear that emi does understand it well. (kenji also develops an ear for her chirping/squawks, though body language & facial expressions play a big part in communication for both of them) during her (much later) rebellious phase she'll simply pretend not to know what's being said when kenji is telling her to do something she doesn't wanna do, which frustrates him to no end
Kenji
developed a pretty massive chip on his shoulder after moving to the states. it wasn't just bitterness over his dad staying behind, though that was a part of it. this is canon but he was picked on in school for "how [he talked], how [he looked] and what [he ate]." he felt like he had something to prove to both his father and the world. he threw himself into sports - specifically baseball - and his academics, and he did so well that it forced everyone to shut up about how he was different from them and focus on how he was better than them
^ playing off this: kenji had a bonkers fucking yonkers routine when he was a kid/in highschool. he'd get up hours before school started to practice his swing, go for a ~1hr run, workout, study, etc. He'd go to school, come home, and do it all again. this is exaggerated but my point is that this kid was DETERMINED and had the discipline to see that determination through to the end
didnt have many friends because of all aforementioned things. he had acquaintances, and he was invited to parties and outings and stuff (never went), but he spent most of his free time hanging out with his mom. he never really had a "parents are so embarrassing" phase. he always liked to do anything with his mother: going to the bank, going grocery shopping, watching cheesy telenovelas till ungodly hours in the morning, etc. she was his no.1 supporter, confidant, and best friend
he played for his university's baseball team and got scouted at 19. his mom forced him to finish his bachelor's first so once he graduated with his degree in kinesiology at 21, he was drafted to the dodgers
Kenji & Ami
both of them, up until meeting each other, were totally dedicated to their career (and child) so they had basically 0 time for friends. theyre both borderline losers but theyre juuust good enough at what they do for people to admire them instead of finding them sad and lowkey pathetic
kenji is way more into the idea of being friends than ami is. hes pretty enthusiastic about it; he thinks that they have a kind of rapport, since they share a similar work ethic and are both (unbeknownst to ami) single parents. he calls her to chat abt random things. ami initially isnt superrrr into it; she thinks kenji is kinda lonely and desperate for human connection, & it isnt until her mom points out that she has not spoken to anyone outside of work-related reasons in 10+ years that shes like oh shit, i am also lonely and desperate for human connection. so she grudgingly acquires a friend. theyre both really bad at it
need to clarify that in my mind their dynamic is 95% kenji yapping about work and drama in his personal life (circumventing the 8m baby kaiju hes raising) while ami goes "mhm mhm" and takes notes until kenji notices and is like What are you doing. at which point ami is like...... right . nothing. im listening. and forces herself to put the notepad away. she has a hard time disengaging from the reporter mindset and just hearing something intriguing without turning it into an article. the other 5% are the rare moments where theyre connecting super well - ami's psychoanalyzing the hell out of whatever kenji just said and hes like what are you my therapist. over time she starts opening up to him, too, and eventually theyre comfortable enough to be having philosophical discussions over breakfast just for funsies
before kenji reveals that hes ultraman, ami thinks hes in a gang. he keeps showing up to their lunch "dates" with like bruised eyes and fractured bones and gets all shifty when she tries to ask about what happened. when she eventually confronts him about it, hes so offended that she thinks hed be involved in something like that that he tells her about being ultraman
thats about all i can think of rn, though im sure ill think of more after rotating all the characters in my head for a while. thanks again for stopping in, i appreciate the support :)
#sorry this took so ridiculously long for me to get to#i didnt have too many hcs before i sat down to think about it and i didnt wanna just talk about kenji#honestly. if im being honest. lemme be honest. i find it hard to write for and/or about emi#shes cute asf i loved her in the movie but since she is a literal baby child its difficult for me to get a grasp on her#i can only really think ahead to when she grows up and starts developing a bit more of a personality#anyway. hope this is suffices#ultraman rising#ami wakita#kenji sato#emi sato#mine#asks#anon#trending in japan#entry 2 in the TIJ tag lets goooooooo#just to be clear btw. ami & kenji is a platonic thing to me#not that i hate the idea of them together i just dont feel like they have that sort of chemistry#and anyway (i talked abt this in the notes on TIJ ch.3 but) i lowkey hc kenji as aroace so it doesnt gel w my personal interpretation of hi#but take it as romantic if u want i really dc. theyre silly together in any way
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